Live Business Chat
2015 Sep 11, 09:00:56 am *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: This is a friendly non-profit discussion group about making money. Click the "NOTIFY" button every chance you get to receive instant alerts about new information. We don't like spam. If your first posts are about something you want from us, it is probably spam, and you will be banned in forums worldwide. No soliciting! If you have problems with the forum, contact badon in the business chat.
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #93 - Back to the basics, popularity  (Read 6369 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
badon
Administrator
Capitalist Pig
*****
Online Online

Posts: 10305


badon™


« on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:43:06 am »



The article is broken up into separate posts - The coin investments list is at the end of the article

There's a lot more I want to say than this, but as tamo42 has mentioned in his comments, things have been quiet lately, so I'll keep this brief. I need to redo the "badon's choices" section to focus on the rarest, most popular coins. Right now, many of the more common investment grade coins are going very cheap, but there's also availability of rarer coins. Those aren't so cheap, but remember, bargains in rare coins are AVAILABILITY, not low prices.

If you're worried about short term market fluctuations like we're experiencing now, your best coins will be the popular ones. Rarity helps, and adds to popularity, but the #1 factor that determines whether your coin is going to be marketable in a weak market is popularity. The most popular modern Chinese coins are:

1. Dragon and phoenix (marriage theme symbolism)
2. Peacocks (marriage theme symbolism)
3. Pandas, especially silver, the rarer the better
4. Normal sized expo pandas, especially gold accented silver ones, and silver Munich expo medals
5. 1979 year of the child, and possibly other child-themed coins like the 1989 children's fund panda

Some rising stars:

6. 1990 goldfish medals
7. God of longevity 3 tael silver medals

The child-themed coins are undervalued right now. They should rank higher on this list, because they have a family theme, like the dragon & phoenix, and the peacocks. The dragon & phoenix and peacocks both have marriage symbolism that is deeply rooted in Chinese culture, and the year of the child coins follow closely in popularity. None of them are cheap, but they do become available at reasonable prices.

The 1989 children's fund coins come in proof and BU versions, and both types have a planned mintage of 30,000. They have sold for as much as $400 ungraded, but I have seen them in an NCS conserved 69 grade for half that much lately. Anything under $300 is an excellent investment in a 69 grade, since they have a lot of popularity potential that is weak right now. Beware of white spots though, there's a few nasty ones floating around out there.

All the other rare coins that I normally love in my list because they were undervalued, are not so undervalued anymore due to recent price gains,  AND, they're hurting because they're not popular enough to keep them liquid. I think it's wise to own nice specimens of the god of war & wealth if you can get good prices on them, but the god of longevity is more popular, so I'd get that one first if you can.

I emphasized rarity previously, and now I'm going to emphasize popularity. Popularity will make your portfolio more resistant to the ups and downs, so you won't worry about fluctuations when they happen, if they happen. Any coin in the short list above would be good to buy in larger quantities, with the assurance that their popularity will allow you to sell them when you're ready.

With so many excellent investments selling cheaply, you really can have it all. Get rare AND popular coins, and you can sit comfortably regardless of what the market is doing. They're less risky, but also less profitable. If you have a lot of money, you can do like I do and buy god of war & wealth, non-panda expo coins, painting and art themed coins, three kingdoms, etc. You never know which of those is going to pop next, so if you can afford to, go ahead and take the risk and make sure you have some variety that isn't so popular right now, when prices are cheap.

For everyone else, focus on the bread and butter coins - the flagship coins that everyone has always loved, and always will. You may not make quite as much money, but you'll nearly always be making at least a little money, with eager buyers anytime you're ready to sell.

I swear, I meant for this article to be brief, but it looks like it's got some handy info in it. Good luck!
« Last Edit: 2011 Oct 02, 11:50:11 pm by badon » Logged

If families are a problem for the system, then we must reject the system, not the families.
Founder of the Coin Compendium (forum, blogs, calendar, images, donate, contribute).
LBC makes you rich, with a free ebay gift certificate awarded every month!
The Coin Compendium and the china-mint.info forum, censure, disclosure.
Do not PM questions. Answers should be publicly available.
Backup is not enough. Protect your data with MultiPar.
Writer of LBC Chinese coin investment articles (list).
About me: User:Badon - MediaWiki.org
Badon effect: type 1 to 8, type 9.
I type faster on a TypeMatrix.
Use my work. Give credit.
Coin, medal, whatever!
Coin storage advice.
FreeArc is amazing.
User contributions for Badon - Coin Compendium
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #1 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:43:31 am »

Another quiet couple of days. There have been some tremendous bargains available lately. I hope you are stocking up. A 1987 P gold proof panda set went for $3700. That's right about melt value. And this is for a set of coins that has a mintage of 10,000! On the other hand, a 1/20 oz gold auspicious matters coin sold for over $400 on an auction. Perhaps the auspicious matters series is gaining in popularity.

Either way, the general sale continues with most coins trading in the lower areas of their ranges.

Use this market weakness to buy!
« Last Edit: 2011 Oct 01, 08:06:42 am by tamo42 » Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #2 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:43:38 am »

Table of contents


Not everything is in the table of contents, but all the important stuff is here.

* Opera web browser
* Coins sold from the previous list
* Chinese coins are better
* Register, read replies, get NOTIFICATIONS, access drafts
* Recommended reading
* Our choices
* Problem sellers
* NCS conserved
* 70 grade coins
* Proof pandas
* BU pandas
* Investment grade 1/2 oz silver pandas
* Investment grade large date and small date pandas
* Platinum and palladium pandas
* Other pandas and expo coins
* Lunar coins
* Other investment grade coins
* Helpful searches
« Last Edit: 2011 Oct 01, 08:03:36 am by tamo42 » Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #3 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:43:50 am »

Coins sold from the Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #92 article


Coin Sold  Sale Price  Sale Type  Melt RatioAg oz priceAu oz price
1987 P gold proof panda 5 coin set NGC PF 68-69 UC$3702.12a1.19123.2.27
1989 1/10 oz gold panda PCGS MS 69$246.9a1.518.230.15
1990 1 oz gold lunar horse NGC PF 69 UC$4099.99o2.52136.2.52
1990 1/10 oz gold panda large date PCGS MS 69$259.44a1.598.650.15
1990 P 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM$275a9.179.170.16
1991 1 oz silver panda small date NGC MS 69$260b8.678.670.16
1991 1/10 oz gold panda large date PCGS MS 69$260a1.608.670.16
1993 1/10 oz gold panda large date PCGS MS 69$269.44a1.658.990.16
1994 22 g silver invention & discovery bells NCS NGC PF 69 UC$266b12.58.870.16
1996 P 1/20 oz gold proof unicorn PCGS PR 69 DCAM$335b4.1211.10.20
1997 1/2 oz silver panda NGC MS 69$85b5.672.830.05
1997 1/20 oz gold auspicious matters NGC MS 69$427a5.2514.20.26
1998 1 oz silver colored proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$152.5a5.085.080.09
1999 1 oz silver Beijing expo panda NGC MS 69$345a11.511.50.21
2003 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70$550o18.318.30.33
2004 1 oz silver Beijing expo panda NGC MS 69$181a6.036.030.11
2005 1/2 oz gold panda PCGS MS 70$1594.99b1.9653.20.98
2006 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70$599a19.919.90.36
2010 1 oz silver capital market panda NGC MS 69$145.5a4.854.850.08
Total 19 coins:$14053.88468.8.64
Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #4 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:44:10 am »

Our choices


badon's choices

* Coins in a 70 grade
* Dragon and phoenix (marriage theme symbolism)
* Peacocks (marriage theme symbolism)
* Pandas, especially silver, the rarer the better
* Normal sized expo pandas, especially gold accented silver ones, and silver Munich expo medals
* 1979 year of the child, and possibly other child-themed coins like the 1989 children's fund panda
* 1990 goldfish medals
* God of longevity 3 tael silver medals

tamo42's choices

* fractional gold pandas from the 80s and 90s
* gold proof pandas selling at a discount to gold BU pandas
* dragons of all types
* 5 oz silver proof pandas
* Everything that is on sale!
« Last Edit: 2011 Oct 02, 11:49:27 pm by badon » Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #5 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:44:24 am »

NCS conserved



Sellers who list coins with the words "NCS conserved" somewhere in their Ebay listing will show up here, regardless of grade. This is to enhance the value of both high and low grade coins that have been conserved, and can be advertised with the phrase "This coin has been conserved by NCS", or something similar.

NCS conserved Chinese coins

I routinely pay hundreds or even thousands of dollars EXTRA for a coin that comes from a dealer that I know always conserves his coins. If I pay thousands of dollars for a rare silver coin, it would be a tragedy if it developed the dreaded White Spots of Death later. I have never had a problem with any of my conserved silver coins.

If we're going to get NCS and NGC to start labeling conserved coins, we have to help dealers to earn a little extra money for them. This is a chicken-and-egg problem, where nobody labels NCS conserved coins because nobody is looking for them, and nobody is looking for them because nobody labels them. Now, sellers can tell us (on the honor system) which coins have been conserved.
Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #6 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:45:14 am »

70 grade coins

1986 24 g silver Empress of China NGC MS 70

Sale Terms: $650 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 90000
Grade Stats: 10% earn this grade or better (20 out of 189 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $67-$128 MS 69
Comments: Problem seller. Rare in investment grade.

1986 24 g silver Empress of China NGC MS 70

Sale Terms: $379.95 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 90000
Grade Stats: 10% earn this grade or better (20 out of 189 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $67-$128 MS 69
Comments: Rare in investment grade.

1989 1/4 oz gold New York expo panda NGC PF 70 UC

Sale Terms: $6950 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 5000
Grade Stats: 02% earn this grade or better (2 out of 72 graded in total)
Recent Sales:
Comments: Scarce!

Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #7 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:45:27 am »

1990 1/10 oz gold panda large date NGC MS 70

Sale Terms: $2795 Buy-It-Now, or offer.
Mintage: 216546
Grade Stats: 14% earn this grade or better (1 out of 7 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $248-$550 MS 69
Comments: Rare in investment grade, even considering that the grading stats do not include 49 non-attributed coins. This is towards the upper end of the 3-5x range for MS 70s, but there are only 3 of them (1 large date, 2 unattributed) known to exist presently. There was a recent sale of $2400 from the same seller, but it was likely canceled.

1990 15 g silver unearthed discoveries leopard NGC PF 70 UC

Sale Terms: $1388 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 5000
Grade Stats: 03% earn this grade or better (4 out of 114 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $455 PF 69
Comments: Scarce!

1994 27 g silver olympic boxing NCS NGC PF 70 UC

Sale Terms: $600 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 30000
Grade Stats: 24% earn this grade or better (6 out of 25 graded in total)
Recent Sales:
Comments: Rare in investment grade. NCS conserved!

Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #8 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:45:32 am »

1997 2/3 oz silver modern paintings penguin NGC PF 70 UC

Sale Terms: $1950 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 8800
Grade Stats: 04% earn this grade or better (6 out of 147 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $950 PF 69
Comments: Underpriced at only 2x the PF 69 price. Rare in investment grade.

2000 1 oz silver Guangzhou expo panda NGC MS 70

Sale Terms: $3750 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 40000
Grade Stats: 02% earn this grade or better (2 out of 82 graded in total)
Recent Sales:
Comments: Rare in investment grade.

2001 D 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70

Sale Terms: $2999 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 33000
Grade Stats: 03% earn this grade or better (18 out of 569 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $144-$232 MS 69
Comments: Problem seller. Rare in investment grade.

Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
tamo42
Capitalist Pig
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 17830



WWW
« Reply #9 on: 2011 Oct 01, 07:45:35 am »

2002 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70

Sale Terms: $2650 Buy-It-Now, or offer.
Mintage: 500000
Grade Stats: 11% earn this grade or better (85 out of 757 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $600-$911
Comments:

2003 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70

Sale Terms: $1299.99 Buy-It-Now.
Mintage: 600000
Grade Stats: 16% earn this grade or better (250 out of 1480 graded in total)
Recent Sales: $550-$1150
Comments: This is a bit on the high side, but it's the only one available right now.

2005 1 kg silver panda NGC PF 70 UC

Sale Terms: $17995 Buy-It-Now, or offer.
Mintage: 4000
Grade Stats: 03% earn this grade or better (1 out of 30 graded in total)
Recent Sales:
Comments: Scarce! The 2004 that's been in the list lately has an auction starting price of $7000, so I don't think the price this seller is asking is reasonable. But, the door is open to make an offer, so I decided to list this coin because of that. Otherwise, the price is high enough that I would not have listed it. 70 coins require the right buyer. A patient seller can hold out for any price they want when they own the only known specimen in a 70 grade. If you have to have the best of the best, maybe consider putting out an offer around $7000.

Logged

Neal McSpadden
Get Coin Investments List Updates Here
The Primal Prepper - my blog about preparing for the worst while living the best
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.041 seconds with 17 queries.