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Author Topic: Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #87 - Time to think ahead  (Read 8314 times)
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badon
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« on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:30:43 am »



The article is broken up into separate posts - The coin investments list is at the end of the article

Lots of coins are still changing hands at reduced prices. People are selling only to raise cash for more buying. The biggest winners at the end of this will be the ones that can raise the most cash without selling coins. With a coming inflationary epoch, making money NOW, when your earnings have more value, is a wise thing to do.

In my December 2010 article Cash is king for 2011, I predicted that decreased inflation would slow the economy. We've been experiencing that now. I also predicted that we would have "availability" of high-end rarities, and we're experiencing that right now too. Sometimes it's wise to review my old articles that speak about what the future will be like. It puts the current time into perspective, so instead of "living in the moment", you can take a step back and position your chess pieces for gains in the future.

I've often said that money is made when you buy, not when you sell. The fundamental reason for this is that the future matters more than the present time. When people "live in the moment", they're actually reacting to the past. It's not really even possible to "live in the moment" because each moment is long gone before you get a chance to think of it anyway.

Instead, you need to learn from the past, to deal with the present, in order to plan your future. You need to purchase well, so your coins will sell themselves when the time comes.

See Batman's new post for more chess analogies:

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=3946.0
« Last Edit: 2011 Sep 10, 09:49:27 pm by badon » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:33:29 am »

It was the best of times. It was the worst of times.

The past week has seen both record highs and (recent) record lows. The 1997 P silver unicorn and later-year MS 70 pandas seem to be heating up. Also, some of the more rare coin auctions have seen huge sales realized in the past week.

Then there are what I call the familiarity-breeds-contempt coins. The mid-90s silver coins seem to be taking a beating. The high prices we saw a month or two ago have brought a lot more supply to the market, depressing prices. What you need to remember is that the supply is limited. The slowdown is ending, so both the high-end coins (like the 1994 1 oz gold unicorn that sold for $10k) and the low-end coins (like the 2009 1 oz silver panda that sold for $300) are picking up steam. The middle-market coins have not yet.

The next few weeks will likely be a great buying opportunity for these middle-of-the-road coins as a lagging sector. I'm willing to bet that in 3 months' time, you'll be kicking yourself if you don't pick up a few.
« Last Edit: 2011 Sep 10, 10:06:43 am by tamo42 » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:33:32 am »

Table of contents


Not everything is in the table of contents, but all the important stuff is here.

* Opera web browser
* Coins sold from the previous list
* Chinese coins are better
* Register, read replies, get NOTIFICATIONS, access drafts
* Recommended reading
* Our choices
* Problem sellers
* NCS conserved
* 70 grade coins
* Proof pandas
* BU pandas
* Investment grade 1/2 oz silver pandas
* Investment grade large date and small date pandas
* Platinum and palladium pandas
* Other pandas and expo coins
* Lunar coins
* Other investment grade coins
* Helpful searches
« Last Edit: 2011 Sep 10, 09:57:55 am by tamo42 » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:33:40 am »

Opera web browser



I have found that the fastest web browser for loading these pages of coins is the Opera web browser. With other browsers, my fastest quad core computer slows down a lot on just one page. With Opera, I can load the whole thing up on my slowest computer, no problem. Get it now:

http://www.opera.com/browser/download/

There's also a handy "portable" version that does not require installation:

http://www.opera-usb.com/operausben.htm

Click on "Mainpage" to find versions in other languages besides English
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« Reply #4 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:35:05 am »

Coins sold from the Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #86 article


2009 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 - $300 - A new high for this coin.

1997 P 1 oz silver proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC - $663.67  - Over $100 above recent sales!

Coin Sold  Sale Price  Sale Type  Melt RatioAg oz priceAu oz price
1979 1/2 oz gold 30th anniversary PRC 4 coin set NGC PF 68-69 UC$5919auction1.59143.3.18
1979 1/2 oz gold Beijing scenery 4 coin set NGC PF 69 UC$7388auction1.98178.3.97
1979 1/2 oz gold year of the child NGC PF 69 CA$3450auction3.7183.31.85
1985 27 g silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$2200auction61.253.11.18
1986 22 g silver Chinese historical figures Sima Qian NCS NGC PF 70 UC$488Buy-It-Now16.611.70.26
1987 P 1 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$2425auction1.3058.61.30
1987 P 1/10 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$323auction1.737.800.17
1987 P 1/2 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$1156auction1.2427.90.62
1987 P 1/4 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$602.1auction1.2914.50.32
1987 P gold proof panda 5 coin set NGC PF 67-69 UC$4250auction1.20102.2.28
1988 P 1/4 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$645auction1.3815.50.34
1989 15 g silver lunar snake NGC PF 69 UC$433auction21.610.40.23
1990 1 oz silver dragon & phoenix NGC MS 69$699.99Buy-It-Now16.916.90.37
1990 1 oz silver panda small date NGC MS 69$231.1auction5.585.580.12
1991 1 oz silver panda large date NGC MS 69$214.72auction5.185.180.11
1992 27 g silver endangered species snow leopard NCS NGC PS 69 UC$388Buy-It-Now10.89.370.20
1992 P 1 oz silver proof panda frosted leaf NGC PF 69 UC$511.2auction12.312.30.27
1993 1 oz silver panda small date NGC MS 69$425Buy-It-Now10.210.20.22
1994 1 oz gold proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC$10109auction5.43244.5.43
1994 P 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$860offer20.720.70.46
1994 proof panda 3 coin set NGC PF 69 UC$4638auction4.75112.2.49
1994 proof unicorn 2 coin set NGC PF 69 UC$13108auction9.36316.7.05
1996 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC$578auction13.913.90.31
1996 1 oz silver proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC$493auction11.911.90.26
1997 1 oz silver unicorn NGC MS 69$149auction3.603.600.08
1997 P 1 oz silver proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC$663.67auction16.016.00.35
1998 1 oz silver panda large date NGC MS 69$330auction7.977.970.17
1999 1 oz silver Beijing expo panda NGC PF 69 UC$320.99auction7.757.750.17
2001 D 1 oz silver panda NCS NGC MS 69$143.5auction3.463.460.07
2001 D 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 69$163.51auction3.953.950.08
2004 1 oz silver Beijing expo panda NGC MS 69$222.51auction5.375.370.11
2005 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70$365offer8.828.820.19
2005 1 oz silver Shanghai bank panda NGC MS 69$219.95offer5.315.310.11
2006 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70$380auction9.189.180.20
2007 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70$356auction8.608.600.19
2007 1/4 oz silver 25th anniversary proof panda 1982 NGC PF 69 UC$90offer8.692.170.04
2008 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70$299.99auction7.247.240.16
2009 1 oz gold panda PCGS MS 70$3250Buy-It-Now1.7478.51.74
2009 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70$300auction7.247.240.16
2010 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70$142.49auction3.443.440.07
2010 1 oz silver Shanghai mint panda NGC MS 69$172.49auction4.164.160.09
2011 1 oz silver colored lunar rabbit NGC PF 70 UC$162.49auction3.923.920.08
Total 43 coins:$69266.70167337.2
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« Reply #5 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:36:55 am »

Chinese coins are better





* Fidelity Overseas Fund (FOSFX)
* NASDAQ Average
* Brazilian Stock Index (BVSP)
* Crude Oil
* Gold
* Silver
* Chinese coins

This information comes from http://www.pandacollector.com/
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« Reply #6 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:36:59 am »

Sell your coins on LBC or CCF forums



The Chinese coin marketplace on LBC is a topic started by groovemachine for selling coins amongst LBC members. It's been around for a while now, and seems to be getting interesting, so I figured I would mention it here. Ebay is by far the best place to buy and sell coins, but sometimes it's interesting to see what's been posted over there.

There's also a similar place at the CCF
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« Reply #7 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:37:04 am »

Register, read replies, get NOTIFICATIONS, access drafts



Always come back to check the replies on these articles. That's where most of the good stuff is! Register on the forums and click the "NOTIFY" button on this article to receive email notifications of new replies that may make some easy money for the first person to read it. Many of the best coins only last for a few minutes or seconds before somebody grabs them. If you get notified of replies, you'll be able to see anything new that I list right when I list it. You'll also stay informed of the hot topics, and see what other people are talking about buying.

Also, once you're registered on the forums, you can access the drafts forum where I post stuff I'm working on. Having access to my drafts lets you see the good stuff before anybody else - sometimes only minutes before, and sometimes more than a week before! You'll have valuable advanced information before the rest of the market gets it! Of course, you MUST click on the "NOTIFY" button for the drafts forum if you want to receive an instant notification that a draft has been posted.

Hint: Once you see the first draft, click the "NOTIFY" button for the draft. When my draft is almost ready for publishing, I break up the post into replies that follow the first post of the draft. You'll get a notification that a reply has been posted, and that will tell you the draft is almost done. A near-finished draft with the replies will contain more, better info than the first draft notification, so that's the good info you want to see.

Finally, you'll want to stay up-to-date on my postings, so click the "NOTIFY" button on my blog forum. You may want to take a look there from time to time, especially to read my older postings that are packed with valuable money-making information. If you're wondering if I'm worth listening to, you can see a list of my articles sorted by date. Check out the older ones to see my track record at predicting the markets. It's impressive, if I do say so myself. No one on the planet as a track record like mine. You can trust my predictions, they're always right!
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« Reply #8 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:37:09 am »

NCS and NGC need to help buyers find conserved coins for long term investment



I've talked a lot about NCS conservation of silver coins, especially the ones with the highest grades that were graded in the past. Coins that were not conserved before grading could degrade over time as invisible residues corrode their surfaces. That could make your investments virtually worthless!

There are nuances to which coins are worrisome, and which aren't, so I've recommended coins that look good despite not knowing whether they've been conserved or not. For example, an old silver coin that still looks good after many years is probably OK, and a newer panda that came from modern PVC-free packaging is probably OK too. But, the only way to know for sure is to only buy coins that have been conserved before grading.

Sadly, NCS and NGC continue to refuse to indicate on the holders if a coin has been conserved, even if requested. I have begged them to let me buy coins that I know will not become hunks of scrap metal over time, and they won't listen to me - just one person - but they will listen to the market as a whole. That means you. Everyone needs to contact NCS and tell them you want to buy coins that you know have been conserved. Tell them that you want to buy coins that NGC marks as conserved on their holders. Here's the person to contact:

Craig Fiumara
Numismatic Conservation Services
Operations Manager
Phone 866-627-2646  Ext. 145
Fax 941-360-2559
CraigF@NCScoin.com

Once we persuade them that we want to know that our coins are safe, they will obey our demands and start marking the conserved coins. Only then can we be reasonably certain (but never 100%) that our investments will not become worthless over time.
 
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« Reply #9 on: 2011 Sep 10, 09:37:13 am »

NCS conserved certificates?



What if NCS started selling certificates that said that a coin had been conserved? Would you want one for each of your coins, so you could prove to a buyer that your coins are professionally conserved? It's been impossible so far to persuade NCS and NGC to start labeling conserved coins. But, they may be willing to produce certificates, especially if it earns them a little extra money.

Prices earned by sellers have been significantly better for the coins they advertise as NCS conserved. When buyers have a choice between 2 coins, one that's cheaper, but not NCS conserved, and one that's significantly more expensive, but has been NCS conserved, the buyers almost always choose the NCS coins first. Once those are gone, then the unconserved coins start selling again.

Many of the sellers are able to provide paperwork to show that a coin has been conserved, and the seller's reputation leads to buyers trusting sellers when they say the coins are conserved. But what about the buyer when it comes time to sell? It would be very helpful if they had a certificate from NCS that says for certain that a coin has been conserved. It would add value to the coins when they initially sell from a dealer, and it will also make it easier for the buyer to sell later too.

Further down in this article is Craig Fiumara's contact information at NCS. It would be helpful to make this possibility a reality if you told him you'd like to buy conservation certificates for your coins.
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