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Author Topic: Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #68  (Read 5474 times)
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badon
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« on: 2011 Jul 02, 11:42:56 am »



The article is broken up into separate posts - The coin investments list is at the end of the article

The slowdown should be peaking, but buying activity is still quite vigorous. People are holding out for bargains, but the best coins are still going for very strong prices. Lunar coin prices are adjusting to reflect their rarity compared to other lunars in the same series. Many lunars were available, but are now gone, and buyers are not moving to buy up the remaining coins because they're hoping for better prices, which may or may not come before the slowdown is over.

Buyers have been spoiled with plentiful availability of rare coins. In fact, so many rare coins are available at cheap prices that buyers are stretching their finances to the maximum to obtain them. But, the number of coins listed during the last few days have shown slowing in the willingness to let them go at cheap prices.

There has been increased interest in the Auspicious Matters series of coins, mostly the ones with the boy and carp. They're very beautiful coins, but with higher mintages than what normally excites people from an investment perspective. However, the increasing popularity of the series is causing dealers to submit more of them for grading, and they are now hitting the market. The availability of investment-grade coins has further increased interest in the series. The power of popularity seems to be favoring this series at this time.

Even though the mintages are mostly in the 50,000 range or higher, the Auspicious Matters coins are worth watching because that mintage is still quite low in comparison to the number of potential buyers, if they become popular. American coins with similar mintages often sell for $1000+, so as the definition of rarity moves upward to coins with larger and larger mintages, the Auspicious Matters coins are likely to get swept up to higher prices faster than would be expected with their relatively high mintage compared to other coins that are now considered rare.

However, these are the planned mintages - the actual mintages could be lower. Many of the coins from this series have familiar dates like 1997, 1998, etc when it was known that coins often were minted in very low numbers.
« Last Edit: 2011 Jul 02, 07:33:57 pm by badon » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:09:27 pm »

Table of contents



Not everything is in the table of contents, but all the important stuff is here.

* Opera web browser
* Coins sold from the previous list
* Chinese coins are better
* Register, read replies, get NOTIFICATIONS, access drafts
* Recommended reading
* My choices
* Problem sellers
* NCS conserved
* 70 grade coins
* Proof pandas
* BU pandas
* Investment grade 1/2 oz silver pandas
* Investment grade large date and small date pandas
* Platinum and palladium pandas
* Other pandas and expo coins
* Lunar coins
* Other investment grade coins
* Helpful searches
« Last Edit: 2011 Jul 02, 07:33:35 pm by badon » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:09:36 pm »

Opera web browser



I have found that the fastest web browser for loading these pages of coins is the Opera web browser. With other browsers, my fastest quad core computer slows down a lot on just one page. With Opera, I can load the whole thing up on my slowest computer, no problem. Get it now:

http://www.opera.com/browser/download/

There's also a handy "portable" version that does not require installation:

http://www.opera-usb.com/operausben.htm

Click on "Mainpage" to find versions in other languages besides English.
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If families are a problem for the system, then we must reject the system, not the families.
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« Reply #3 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:09:51 pm »

Coins sold from the Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #67 article



2007 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 was listed at $400 Buy-It-Now, $200 auction, and it finally sold for $399 - just $1 under the Buy-It-Now price.

2009 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70 sold for $265 auction, and another 2009 1 oz silver 25th anniversary panda NGC MS 70 sold for $286 auction. NGC graded coins are starting to consistently sell for more than PCGS graded coins.

2002 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 69 sold for $232.49 at auction, which is about $60 cheaper than usual. Seller used a stock photo, and that's the only reason I can think of for this to have sold so cheap.

1983 brass panda NGC PF 69 CA sold for $1025 at auction. These used to be considered common, and you could get them for around $15!

1991 1 oz platinum lunar goat NGC PF 69 UC sold for $19,100 at auction. Prices like this prove that the rarest coins don't care about slowdowns - they always get high prices.

1998 2/3 oz silver scallop plum blossom flower lunar tiger NGC PF 69 UC sold for $750 Buy-It-Now, and a 2010 1 oz silver scallop flower lunar tiger NGC PF 69 UC sold for $226 at auction. These used to sell for about the same price, even though the 1998 has a mintage of 6800 and the 2010 has a mintage of 60,000. The diverging prices is a positive sign showing that the market is starting to recognize the rarity of the older lunar coins. Additionally, it shows that the market is very strong and healthy - a weak or unhealthy market would not show prices correcting UPWARDS during a slowdown! Notice that the 1998 coin is about 10 times rarer than the 2010 coin, but it's still selling for only about 3 times the price. That is a clue that there is A LOT more room for UPWARD price movement on the rarer coins. I think we'll see more of this upward movement when the slowdown begins to decline in July, August, and September.

1992 27 g silver WWF white storks NGC PF 69 UC sold for $305.55 at auction. These are starting to cost more serious money.



2002 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 69 $0.99 auction.
2002 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70 $859 Buy-It-Now.
1992 1/2 oz gold Munich expo panda NGC PF 69 UC $2200 auction.
1997 15 g silver WWF panda NGC PF 69 UC $140 auction.
1992 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC $599 Buy-It-Now.
1996 1 oz silver proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC $459 Buy-It-Now.
2000 2/3 oz silver scallop flower lunar dragon NGC PF 69 UC $1350 Buy-It-Now.
1991 1 oz gold proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM $4500 Buy-It-Now.
2002 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $956 auction.
2002 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $925 auction.
2005 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $316.95 auction.
2005 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $349.99 Buy-It-Now.
2005 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $410 offer.
2007 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $399 auction.
2007 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $475 offer.
2007 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $401.88 auction.
2008 gold & silver Beijing olympics 6 coin set PF 70 UC $1699 auction. Problem seller.
2008 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 $340.69 auction.
2009 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 70 $265 auction.
2009 1 oz silver 25th anniversary panda NGC MS 70 $286 auction.
1990 1/2 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC $1498 Buy-It-Now.
1991 1 oz gold proof 10th anniversary panda NGC PF 69 UC $7700 auction.
1994 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC $960 auction.
1995 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC $943.69 auction.
1996 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC $895 Buy-It-Now.
1996 1 oz silver proof panda NGC PF 69 UC $1099 Buy-It-Now.
1999 1/2 oz gold large date serif 1 panda NGC MS 69 $4716 auction.
2000 1 oz silver mirror panda NGC MS 69 $2279.99 Buy-It-now.
2000 1/2 oz gold mirror panda NGC MS 68 $8800 auction.
2002 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 69 $232.49 auction. Stock photo.
2002 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 69 $294 auction.
1990 1 oz platinum panda NGC PF 69 UC $8100 auction. Problem seller.
2003 1/20 oz platinum panda NGC PF 69 UC $227.50 auction.
2004 1/20 oz platinum panda NGC PF 69 UC $285 auction.
1983 brass panda NGC PF 69 CA $1025 auction.
2005 1 oz silver Beijing expo panda NGC PF 69 UC $212.50 auction.
2005 1 oz silver Beijing expo panda NGC MS 69 $209.49 auction.
1991 1 oz platinum lunar goat NGC PF 69 UC $19,100 auction.
1987 8 g gold lunar rabbit NGC PF 69 UC $1675 auction.
1987 5 oz silver lunar rabbit NGC PF 69 UC $1733 auction.
1988 15 g silver lunar dragon NGC PF 69 UC $1000 offer.
1989 1 oz silver lunar snake NGC PF 69 UC $1325 auction.
1998 2/3 oz silver scallop plum blossom flower lunar tiger NGC PF 69 UC $750 Buy-It-Now.
2010 1 oz silver scallop flower lunar tiger NGC PF 69 UC $226 auction.
1980 10 g silver olympic wrestling NGC PF 69 UC $365 auction.
1984 22 g silver Chinese historical figures soldier facing left NGC PF 69 UC $152.50 auction.
1992 27 g silver WWF white storks NGC PF 69 UC $305.55 auction.
1996 1/4 oz gold proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC $1527 auction.
1997 2/3 oz silver modern paintings penguin NGC PF 69 UC $629.69 auction.
1998 1 oz silver auspicious matters NGC MS 69 $192.50 auction.
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« Reply #4 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:10:00 pm »

Chinese coins are better







* Fidelity Overseas Fund (FOSFX)
* NASDAQ Average
* Brazilian Stock Index (BVSP)
* Crude Oil
* Gold
* Silver
* Chinese coins

This information comes from http://www.pandacollector.com/
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« Reply #5 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:10:09 pm »

Sell your coins on LBC or CCF forums



The Chinese coin marketplace on LBC is a topic started by groovemachine for selling coins amongst LBC members. It's been around for a while now, and seems to be getting interesting, so I figured I would mention it here. Ebay is by far the best place to buy and sell coins, but sometimes it's interesting to see what's been posted over there.

There's also a similar place at the CCF
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« Reply #6 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:10:18 pm »

Register, read replies, get NOTIFICATIONS, access drafts



Always come back to check the replies on these articles. That's where most of the good stuff is! Register on the forums and click the "NOTIFY" button on this article to receive email notifications of new replies that may make some easy money for the first person to read it. Many of the best coins only last for a few minutes or seconds before somebody grabs them. If you get notified of replies, you'll be able to see anything new that I list right when I list it. You'll also stay informed of the hot topics, and see what other people are talking about buying.

Also, once you're registered on the forums, you can access the drafts forum where I post stuff I'm working on. Having access to my drafts lets you see the good stuff before anybody else - sometimes only minutes before, and sometimes more than a week before! You'll have valuable advanced information before the rest of the market gets it! Of course, you MUST click on the "NOTIFY" button for the drafts forum if you want to receive an instant notification that a draft has been posted.

Hint: Once you see the first draft, click the "NOTIFY" button for the draft. When my draft is almost ready for publishing, I break up the post into replies that follow the first post of the draft. You'll get a notification that a reply has been posted, and that will tell you the draft is almost done. A near-finished draft with the replies will contain more, better info than the first draft notification, so that's the good info you want to see.

Finally, you'll want to stay up-to-date on my postings, so click the "NOTIFY" button on my blog forum. You may want to take a look there from time to time, especially to read my older postings that are packed with valuable money-making information. If you're wondering if I'm worth listening to, you can see a list of my articles sorted by date. Check out the older ones to see my track record at predicting the markets. It's impressive, if I do say so myself. No one on the planet as a track record like mine. You can trust my predictions, they're always right!
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« Reply #7 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:10:26 pm »

NCS and NGC need to help buyers find conserved coins for long term investment



I've talked a lot about NCS conservation of silver coins, especially the ones with the highest grades that were graded in the past. Coins that were not conserved before grading could degrade over time as invisible residues corrode their surfaces. That could make your investments virtually worthless!

There are nuances to which coins are worrisome, and which aren't, so I've recommended coins that look good despite not knowing whether they've been conserved or not. For example, an old silver coin that still looks good after many years is probably OK, and a newer panda that came from modern PVC-free packaging is probably OK too. But, the only way to know for sure is to only buy coins that have been conserved before grading.

Sadly, NCS and NGC continue to refuse to indicate on the holders if a coin has been conserved, even if requested. I have begged them to let me buy coins that I know will not become hunks of scrap metal over time, and they won't listen to me - just one person - but they will listen to the market as a whole. That means you. Everyone needs to contact NCS and tell them you want to buy coins that you know have been conserved. Tell them that you want to buy coins that NGC marks as conserved on their holders. Here's the person to contact:

Craig Fiumara
Numismatic Conservation Services
Operations Manager
Phone 866-627-2646  Ext. 145
Fax 941-360-2559
CraigF@NCScoin.com

Once we persuade them that we want to know that our coins are safe, they will obey our demands and start marking the conserved coins. Only then can we be reasonably certain (but never 100%) that our investments will not become worthless over time.
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« Reply #8 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:10:34 pm »

NCS conserved certificates?



What if NCS started selling certificates that said that a coin had been conserved? Would you want one for each of your coins, so you could prove to a buyer that your coins are professionally conserved? It's been impossible so far to persuade NCS and NGC to start labeling conserved coins. But, they may be willing to produce certificates, especially if it earns them a little extra money.

Prices earned by sellers have been significantly better for the coins they advertise as NCS conserved. When buyers have a choice between 2 coins, one that's cheaper, but not NCS conserved, and one that's significantly more expensive, but has been NCS conserved, the buyers almost always choose the NCS coins first. Once those are gone, then the unconserved coins start selling again.

Many of the sellers are able to provide paperwork to show that a coin has been conserved, and the seller's reputation leads to buyers trusting sellers when they say the coins are conserved. But what about the buyer when it comes time to sell? It would be very helpful if they had a certificate from NCS that says for certain that a coin has been conserved. It would add value to the coins when they initially sell from a dealer, and it will also make it easier for the buyer to sell later too.

Further down in this article is Craig Fiumara's contact information at NCS. It would be helpful to make this possibility a reality if you told him you'd like to buy conservation certificates for your coins.
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LBC makes you rich, with a free ebay gift certificate awarded every month!
The Coin Compendium and the china-mint.info forum, censure, disclosure.
Do not PM questions. Answers should be publicly available.
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« Reply #9 on: 2011 Jul 02, 07:10:45 pm »

Recommended reading



Here's some recent articles of mine that can provide some guidance for investing in the current and coming market conditions:

* LBC makes me rich
* Wealth preservation: USA vs. China (By Zerosum)
* Coins are the hot new investment
* How high will the Chinese coin market go?
* 5 criteria to determine if a coin is a good investment
* 13 coin facts to learn for beginning investors of modern Chinese coins
* For those new to the modern Chinese coin market (By Batman)
* My First Chinese Panda Coin Purchase (By Tamo42)
* Modern Chinese coin investment strategy
* Black Swans, Fake Chinese coins, badon, & ebay! (By r3globe)
* Don't be the "whale" that pays too much for an investment coin
* Modern Chinese coin commentary and market predictions - 2010-Dec-15
* What makes people buy up all the Chinese panda coins?
* Investing in rare modern Chinese coins, some questions answered
* Cash is king for 2011 - Get ready for the coming bargain hunt
* Foresight: Gold, silver, coins, etc will weaken after January or February 2011
* Rumor: Modern Chinese coin charts coming out soon
* Why does this business site talk so much about investments?
* The chess game of rich vs. poor

Here's some handy websites for basic coin facts like mintages:

* Modern China Coins Data sorted by series
* china-mint.info Data sorted by year
* china-mint.info silver actual mintages
* china-mint.info gold actual mintages
* Chinese Coin Forum
* The Coin Compendium is coming!

Gold and Silver Panda Coin Buyer's Guide Book

This is THE panda book, written by the world's foremost expert on Chinese panda coins. Buy the book before the coin. Enough said.

Pricepedia modern Chinese coin price guide with bonus using "LBC" referral code

$68.88 Buy-It-Now.

In addition to the book you can subscribe to the PricePedia, which gives up-to-date monthly pricing information on over 700 different coins, as well as a few pointers on what's hot or undervalued in the market. If you send a message to the author mentioning LBC for the referral code, you get a bonus list of undervalued coins, along with your subscription.
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If families are a problem for the system, then we must reject the system, not the families.
Founder of the Coin Compendium (forum, blogs, calendar, images, donate, contribute).
LBC makes you rich, with a free ebay gift certificate awarded every month!
The Coin Compendium and the china-mint.info forum, censure, disclosure.
Do not PM questions. Answers should be publicly available.
Backup is not enough. Protect your data with MultiPar.
Writer of LBC Chinese coin investment articles (list).
About me: User:Badon - MediaWiki.org
Badon effect: type 1 to 8, type 9.
I type faster on a TypeMatrix.
Use my work. Give credit.
Coin, medal, whatever!
Coin storage advice.
FreeArc is amazing.
User contributions for Badon - Coin Compendium
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