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Author Topic: Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #62  (Read 6796 times)
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badon
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« on: 2011 May 19, 10:00:01 am »



The article is broken up into separate posts - The coin investments list is at the end of the article

This is an exciting list with lots of great coins available. Auctions have been sometimes selling coins very cheaply, while giving bidders fair prices at other times. Prices overall are rising, even at auctions. Platinum pandas are available, and thus "hot". The rarest of the rare are available too, in the 1997 1/10 and 1/20 oz platinum pandas. Get them while you can, it could be a year or longer before you see one again.

Dragons, dragons, dragons. 70, 70, 70. Ancient paintings, modern paintings, all kinds of paintings. There's lots of hot coins right now because this slowdown is throwing us a curveball. Later in the year will be very exciting once all these coins have been bought up.

There's great deals that get posted later in the replies to the article, so be sure to click the "NOTIFY" button so you'll be alerted if something new gets posted. Within 90 seconds of posting, somebody got a coin worth $500 to $600+ for only $150! When you get your notification, you better not waste any time checking to see what it's about!
« Last Edit: 2011 May 19, 03:20:21 pm by badon » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: 2011 May 19, 03:20:42 pm »

Table of contents

Not everything is in the table of contents, but all the important stuff is here.

* Recommended reading
* My choices
* NCS conserved
* 70 grade coins
* Proof pandas
* Rare BU pandas
* Investment grade 1/2 oz silver pandas
* Investment grade large date and small date pandas
* Platinum and palladium pandas
* Other pandas and expo coins
* Lunar coins
* Other investment grade coins
* Helpful searches
« Last Edit: 2011 May 19, 05:59:31 pm by badon » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: 2011 May 19, 03:21:32 pm »

Coins sold from the Modern Chinese coin investments LIST #61 article

2005 1 oz silver proof panda NCG MS 70 sold for $130. It's a $500 to $600 coin. It only lasted about 90 seconds after I posted it, so congrats to whoever grabbed it! It pays to get click the "NOTIFY" button on the articles, so you'll get an email alert when I post something new in the replies.

1997 2/3 oz silver modern painting penguin NGC PF 69 UC sold for $1050, which is a record price. These coins have been ignored for a long time, but now they're taking off. Everything with a painting theme is taking off. The key coin is the eagle, so I'll be watching for those.

Small size gold proof pandas have cooled off, and are a good buy again.

Prices are still steadily rising on the 1986 Empress of China clipper ship coins.

1990 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 sold for $2400 best offer, almost 7 times the price of a 69 coin. WOW! The premium for 70 coins is normally 3 to 5 times the price of a 69, but can range from 2 to 10 times or higher, depending on the coin.

2006 1/2 oz gold scallop plum blossom flower lunar dog NGC PF 70 UC sold for $2526.01 which I think is almost $1000 higher than the last sale price. The mintage is 8000 for the coins minted 2005 and later, while the earlier coins dated 2004 and earlier have a mintage of only 2300. This big price is a good omen for the increasing value of the older coins, which seldom appear for sale anymore. It's hard to track pricing on coins that never get offered for sale, but this is a good clue that the popular demand for plum blossom lunar coins is heating up.

Three 2008 olympic gold and silver 70 grade 6 coin sets went out at bargain pricing of about $1600 to $1900 per set. There's one more still available at the time of this writing, with the bid only up to around $1700. At the pace that 70 coins have been increasing in value lately, those sets are going to be money makers for their new owners. Good job to whoever bought those.

For the first time, I'm noticing PCGS graded coins selling for significantly less than NGC graded coins. I think the market is starting to understand who the top grader is for modern Chinese coins. The NGC guarantee is much better than the PCGS guarantee, and the holders are much better too, especially for silver. Also, conservation is readily available for NGC coins, which means very often NGC coins are better preserved, and look better, than PCGS coins. That's important for a buyer that enjoys the beauty of his coins, or plans to sell them eventually to someone who will pay more for a nice coin. NGC has always been the top grader in China, with PCGS not making much effort to serve that market.

1989 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM sold cheap for $310.04. The buyer might make a little money by sending the coin to NCS/NGC for a crossover, and then putting the coin back on the market for $100 to $150 more.

1992 1 oz silver proof panda varieties sold for $535 and $565 at auction, which are very strong prices for coins that dipped down into the $400 level before the varieties were discovered. Keep watching the 1992 varieties, they've got a lot of room to grow.

Two different 1993 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM sold for $480 and $534.21, which is an interestingly wide spread in pricing. But, they're both too cheap: the Buy-It-Now pricing for the 1993 is around $700. Prices are rising, which is why dealers set their Buy-It-Now pricing so high. It's hard to replace these once they're sold.

1994 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM sold for $1222, after dipping down into the $900 level. This is more evidence that prices are rising.

2001 D 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 69 sold for $180 at auction, while other coin were listed around $300. This was a good time to get a bargain on these, as I hinted in my last article. Good job to whoever got this so cheaply.

This is a perfect example of auctions sometimes going for record prices, and other times going way too cheap. The 1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 sold for a strong price at auction for $139.50, and also for a bargain price of $81.99, while the $129.95 Buy-It-Now was a reliable, fair price. It sold at auction a few other times at around the Buy-It-Now price. What this tells us is that this is a strong market, but an unpredictable one that sometimes overly favors buyers. If you're buying, you can get bargains at auctions. If you're selling, you're better off with fair Buy-It-Now prices.

1995 1 oz silver proof unicorn NCS NGC PF 69 UC for $1350
2000 1 oz silver frosted panda NGC MS 70 for $2500
2005 1 oz silver proof panda NCG MS 70 for $130
1990 2 g silver dragon & phoenix NGC PF 69 UC for $325
1994 1/2 oz gold proof unicorn NGC PF 69 UC for $8000
1997 2/3 oz silver modern painting penguin NGC PF 69 UC for $1050
1991 1/10 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC for $498
1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 for $129.95 Buy-It-Now.
1988 1/4 oz gold proof panda NGC PF 69 UC for $600 best offer.
1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 for $139.95 Buy-It-Now.
1990 1 oz silver panda NGC MS 70 for $2400 best offer.
2006 1/2 oz gold scallop plum blossom flower lunar dog NGC PF 70 UC for $2526.01
2008 gold & silver olympic series 1 6 coin set NGC PF 70 UC for $1674
2008 gold & silver olympic series 2 6 coin set NGC PF 70 UC for $1624
2008 gold & silver olympic series 3 6 coin set NGC PF 70 UC for $1889
1989 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM for $310.04
1991 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM for $452.77
1992 1 oz silver proof 3 frosted leaf clump panda NGC PF 69 UC for $535 auction.
1992 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM for $565
1993 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM for $480
1993 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM for $534.21
1994 1 oz silver proof panda PCGS PR 69 DCAM for $1222
1995 1 oz silver proof wide rim panda NGC PF 69 UC for $1034.99
1995 1 oz silver proof wide rim panda NGC PF 69 UC for $1000
2007 1/4 oz silver proof 25th anniversary 1991 panda NGC PF 70 UC for $114.37
2007 1/4 oz silver proof 25th anniversary 1995 panda NGC PF 70 UC for $107.50
1999 gold large date serif 1 panda 5 coin set NGC PF 69 UC for $17,999.99 auction
2001 D 1 oz silver panda PCGS MS 69 for $180 auction
1987 5 oz silver Hong Kong expo panda NCS NGC PF 69 UC for $1999 auction
1988 1 oz gold Basel expo "PT" version panda NGC PF 68 UC for $6450
1989 1 oz silver New York expo panda horse NGC PF 69 UC for $510
1990 8 g gold lunar horse NGC PF 69 UC for $1396
1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 for $124.69 auction
1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 for $139.50 auction
1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 for $81.99 auction
1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 69 for $129.95 Buy-It-Now.
1988 27 g silver endangered wildlife crested ibis NGC PF 69 UC for $293 auction.
1997 1/10 oz gold forbidden city NGC PF 69 UC for $400
1998 1 oz silver dragon culture NCS NGC MS 69 for $147.50
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« Reply #3 on: 2011 May 19, 03:21:48 pm »

Chinese coins are better

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« Reply #4 on: 2011 May 19, 03:22:51 pm »

Sell your coins on LBC or CCF forums

The Chinese coin marketplace on LBC is a topic started by groovemachine for selling coins amongst LBC members. It's been around for a while now, and seems to be getting interesting, so I figured I would mention it here. Ebay is by far the best place to buy and sell coins, but sometimes it's interesting to see what's been posted over there.

There's also a similar place at the CCF
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« Reply #5 on: 2011 May 19, 03:23:18 pm »

Register, read replies, get notifications, access drafts

Always come back to check the replies on these articles. That's where most of the good stuff is! Register on the forums and click the "NOTIFY" button on this article to receive email notifications of new replies that may make some easy money for the first person to read it. Many of the best coins only last for a few minutes or seconds before somebody grabs them. If you get notified of replies, you'll be able to see anything new that I list right when I list it. You'll also stay informed of the hot topics, and see what other people are talking about buying.

Also, once you're registered on the forums, you can access the drafts forum where I post stuff I'm working on. Having access to my drafts lets you see the good stuff before anybody else - sometimes only minutes before, and sometimes more than a week before! You'll have valuable advanced information before the rest of the market gets it! Of course, you MUST click on the "NOTIFY" button for the drafts forum if you want to receive an instant notification that a draft has been posted.

Finally, you'll want to stay up-to-date on my postings, so click the "NOTIFY" button on my blog forum. You may want to take a look there from time to time, especially to read my older postings that are packed with valuable money-making information. If you're wondering if I'm worth listening to, you can see a list of my articles sorted by date. Check out the older ones to see my track record at predicting the markets. It's impressive, if I do say so myself. No one on the planet as a track record like mine. You can trust my predictions, they're always right!
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« Reply #6 on: 2011 May 19, 03:23:38 pm »

NCS and NGC need to help buyers find conserved coins for long term investment

I've talked a lot about NCS conservation of silver coins, especially the ones with the highest grades that were graded in the past. Coins that were not conserved before grading could degrade over time as invisible residues corrode their surfaces. That could make your investments virtually worthless!

There are nuances to which coins are worrisome, and which aren't, so I've recommended coins that look good despite not knowing whether they've been conserved or not. For example, an old silver coin that still looks good after many years is probably OK, and a newer panda that came from modern PVC-free packaging is probably OK too. But, the only way to know for sure is to only buy coins that have been conserved before grading.

Sadly, NCS and NGC continue to refuse to indicate on the holders if a coin has been conserved, even if requested. I have begged them to let me buy coins that I know will not become hunks of scrap metal over time, and they won't listen to me - just one person - but they will listen to the market as a whole. That means you. Everyone needs to contact NCS and tell them you want to buy coins that you know have been conserved. Tell them that you want to buy coins that NGC marks as conserved on their holders. Here's the person to contact:

Craig Fiumara
Numismatic Conservation Services
Operations Manager
Phone 866-627-2646  Ext. 145
Fax 941-360-2559
CraigF@NCScoin.com

Once we persuade them that we want to know that our coins are safe, they will obey our demands and start marking the conserved coins. Only then can we be reasonably certain (but never 100%) that our investments will not become worthless over time.

NCS conserved certificates?

What if NCS started selling certificates that said that a coin had been conserved? Would you want one for each of your coins, so you could prove to a buyer that your coins are professionally conserved? It's been impossible so far to persuade NCS and NGC to start labeling conserved coins. But, they may be willing to produce certificates, especially if it earns them a little extra money.

Prices earned by sellers have been significantly better for the coins they advertise as NCS conserved. When buyers have a choice between 2 coins, one that's cheaper, but not NCS conserved, and one that's significantly more expensive, but has been NCS conserved, the buyers almost always choose the NCS coins first. Once those are gone, then the unconserved coins start selling again.

Many of the sellers are able to provide paperwork to show that a coin has been conserved, and the seller's reputation leads to buyers trusting sellers when they say the coins are conserved. But what about the buyer when it comes time to sell? It would be very helpful if they had a certificate from NCS that says for certain that a coin has been conserved. It would add value to the coins when they initially sell from a dealer, and it will also make it easier for the buyer to sell later too.

Further down in this article is Craig Fiumara's contact information at NCS. It would be helpful to make this possibility a reality if you told him you'd like to buy conservation certificates for your coins.
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« Reply #7 on: 2011 May 19, 03:23:58 pm »

Recommended reading

Here's some recent articles of mine that can provide some guidance for investing in the current and coming market conditions:

* LBC makes me rich
* Wealth preservation: USA vs. China (By Zerosum)
* Coins are the hot new investment
* How high will the Chinese coin market go?
* 5 criteria to determine if a coin is a good investment
* 13 coin facts to learn for beginning investors of modern Chinese coins
* My First Chinese Panda Coin Purchase (By Tamo42)
* Modern Chinese coin investment strategy
* Don't be the "whale" that pays too much for an investment coin
* Modern Chinese coin commentary and market predictions - 2010-Dec-15
* What makes people buy up all the Chinese panda coins?
* Investing in rare modern Chinese coins, some questions answered
* Cash is king for 2011 - Get ready for the coming bargain hunt
* Foresight: Gold, silver, coins, etc will weaken after January or February 2011
* Rumor: Modern Chinese coin charts coming out soon
* Why does this business site talk so much about investments?
* The chess game of rich vs. poor

Gold and Silver Panda Coin Buyer's Guide Book

This is THE panda book, written by the world's foremost expert on Chinese panda coins. Buy the book before the coin. Enough said.

Pricepedia modern Chinese coin price guide with bonus using "LBC" referral code

$68.88 Buy-It-Now.

In addition to the book you can subscribe to the PricePedia, which gives up-to-date monthly pricing information on over 700 different coins, as well as a few pointers on what's hot or undervalued in the market. If you send a message to the author mentioning LBC for the referral code, you get a bonus list of undervalued coins, along with your subscription.
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« Reply #8 on: 2011 May 19, 03:24:13 pm »

My choices

* The 1986 24 g silver empress of china clipper ship NGC MS 70 coin at $399 is undervalued by somewhere between $20 to $300 now that prices have increased on the 69 coins. 3 to 5 times the value of the 69 coin is the new norm for most silver 70 coins.
* 1997 platinum pandas
* Other platinum pandas, because they're available cheaply at auction and they're MUCH rarer than previously thought.
* 2007 1/4 oz silver 25th anniversary proof pandas
* silver scallop plum blossom flower lunar coins, especially the dragons
* Other lunar coins
* Dragon themed coins
* 1992 1 oz silver proof panda varieties
* Gold-gilded expo pandas
* Other expo coins
* Unicorns, especially the NCS conserved ones, because they're not going to stop rising in value until people can't afford them anymore - that usually means $5000+
* Coins in a 70 grade
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« Reply #9 on: 2011 May 19, 03:24:25 pm »

NCS conserved



Sellers who list coins with the words "NCS conserved" somewhere in their Ebay listing will show up here, regardless of grade. This is to enhance the value of both high and low grade coins that have been conserved, and can be advertised with the phrase "This coin has been conserved by NCS", or something similar.

NCS conserved coins

I routinely pay hundreds or even thousands of dollars EXTRA for a coin that comes from a dealer that I know always conserves his coins. If I pay thousands of dollars for a rare silver coin, it would be a tragedy if it developed the dreaded White Spots of Death later. I have never had a problem with any of my conserved silver coins.

If we're going to get NCS and NGC to start labeling conserved coins, we have to help dealers to earn a little extra money for them. This is a chicken-and-egg problem, where nobody labels NCS conserved coins because nobody is looking for them, and nobody is looking for them because nobody labels them. Now, sellers can tell us (on the honor system) which coins have been conserved.
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Backup is not enough. Protect your data with MultiPar.
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FreeArc is amazing.
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